Common Religious Tactics: The Personal Testimony

During my discussions with the religious, I’ve found that there is a major disconnect between what the theist will accept as valid evidence and what the theist expects others to accept as valid evidence.  While a Christian theist has no problem proclaiming that atheists will see the truth of God’s glory and the reality of hell when they die, they aren’t in any way persuaded by a similar argument that they will see the truth of Valhalla’s existence when they pass away without knowing a glorious death on the field of battle.

One of the areas where this disconnect comes most strongly into play is that arguing tactic known as the “personal testimony.”  Anyone who has been directly involved with Christianity (of absolutely any denomination or creed) has likely heard many personal testimonies describing why an individual believes in a talking snake and a big invisible man in the sky.  Perhaps they heard a voice, or had a prayer answered, or got through a tough time due to the help of religious devotion, or so on.

For those not familiar with this particular phenomena, here is the definition of a “personal testimony” from the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (more commonly known as the Mormons):

“A testimony is knowing something is true through revelation from the Holy Ghost.”

While Christians of other denominations may consider Mormonism to be a cult, it is almost without doubt that they would agree with the above statement if they didn’t know it came from the LDS church. The problem with the personal testimony as an argument for theism is clearly highlighted by the differences between Mormons and absolutely any other denomination of Christianity, from Catholics to Baptists to Pentecostals to Charismatics to Seventh Day Adventists. 

The problem is this: absolutely no one can agree on what the Holy Ghost is truly saying.  Pentecostals believe the Holy Ghost is saying something completely different than what Catholics think its saying.  Mormons think it says something very different from what Baptists think it has said.  The kicker here is that all of these groups are equally convinced that they alone are aware of what the Holy Ghost has really revealed, while simultaneously believing that all the other groups are misled in some way.  None of them ever consider that the rest of these groups feel the same way about them.

To an outside, unbiased observer it is clear that “the Holy Ghost” is nothing more than any given person’s own thoughts and personal feelings.  How else does one explain that one denomination allows priests to marry while another does not, or how one denomination feels that homosexuality is an abomination worthy of hellfire while another disagrees completely?  How else does one explain that Pentecostals fervently believe that baptism and speaking in tongues are required for salvation, while evangelical Christians think it requires nothing more than a telepathic affirmation of your allegiance to Jesus?  All of these completely opposing beliefs are also all drawn from reading the exact same book. Wouldn’t an omniscient, omnipresent, omnipotent God make it more clear what He really required to be saved from an eternity of torture in hell?

While arguing with the religious, it’s critical that the non-believer hold the believer to the same standard as they would hold anyone else.  At the very least, a Christian engaged in debate with an atheist should be able to agree that the same standard of evidence and proof be held by both parties.  If one person in the discussion would refuse to accept a particular argument as valid, it should be agreed that the other party can also refuse to accept that particular argument as valid.

To explain what I mean, let’s take a look at a few personal testimonies I’ve received while debating with the religious.  This first testimony found below is from a person we’ll refer to as “Mr. Habit.” While explaining to my wife why he believed in Christianity and why he felt his supernatural beliefs were more real than those of any other religion, “Mr. Habit” had this to say:

Our delusions are not delusions as you suppose. Us Christians have a sure Rock as a foundation to Hold us at peace when All hell Has Broken Loose. But I challenge you, when Your Job Has no more demand for You, and YOur Friends All Abandon You, And Your Love Ones Abort YOu, We will see if Science is able to Hold on to you...LOL!

But Jesus is the Truth the Way and the Life! For He died And came back to Life. I know because I tried to Live by His Standards and MY Death Was Turned into Life.

My feining Drug Addictions, My unnatural Masturbation Habits which I did so frequently that my penis started to Sting and My Body began to age like a 40 year old and I'm only 25, been masturbating since thirteen, and finally seen it's bad effects and started to quit. Masturbation speeds up the Aging Process. Look at the male Black widow.! When it ejaculates, it takes up so much energy that He dies after Ejaculating.

My Lust habits were so bad that when I would have sex with women of whom i didn't even know their first name several times....

My Bitterness was so bad that I told My OWN Mother that I wish I had never been born, And I wish that I myself had never been Made.

My thoughts Of Suicide were so Bad that I Said to myself... That I might as well Search and Find out if God is REAL or Not Before I give my Life Up For Nothing!

But HOW Could Science Save Me from my bitterness, or Drug Habits, or Fornication Lusts, and My Anger and RAge At Creation?

But O' When I searched OUt Jesus, to get baptized in HIs name to See if He was REal, I took His Word for what It was and I was sorry for all of My sins, and asked him to search my heart , and if there be anything unclean that He would not approve, to take it out that I might Live Pleasing to His Sight! All I wanted to do was be a Good Child to My Mother Growing UP, but when I looked at the World and Our Government and Saw HOw Evil Everything was Governed, I felt That The World was unfair and I decided to Give my life away to Riotous Living.

Until I called out for Jesus and He saved Me!

1) NOw I have Glorious Relationship with my mother!

2) I have become the C.E.O. of my own Non-Profit Organization and am as graceful and meek as a servant!

3) And I no longer snort drugs, nor have sex premaritally, and no longer have thoughts of suicide but have rather thoughts of giving life to those who didn't have a fair chance like me.

See that's What God does, He turns your Sorrow into Rejoicing!

YOur Blame and Shame into fame.

Your Death into life.

Leaving Everything to Follow HIs Word( Christ's Commands) is A way to find Him! Seek and ye shall find. KNock and it shall be openned. As and it shall be given.

First off, I want to point out that, as always, I haven’t changed a single letter of what this Christian wrote. All the misspellings and punctuation errors are original text that hasn’t been altered in any way. We’ll set aside all the absurdities and the bizarre views on masturbation (black widows die from masturbation according to this person?!?), as Megan has already dealt with the subject extensively in her blog at this location.

It should also be noted before moving on that “Mr. Habit” seems to think reality is subjective, as he implied that Christianity would suddenly become more real for me if my friends and family abandoned me.  For the record: something either is real or it isn’t.  Zeus doesn’t become any more or less real just because events in my life go either well or poorly.

Before explaining in detail why I don’t accept the personal testimony of “Mr. Habit” as proof of Christianity's claims, let’s take a look at another Christian testimony I received online some months back.  This one is from a previous conversation on this blog (available here) with an individual I’ll refer to only as “DM.” Here’s the personal testimony from this person:

This is the result of the Bible you say was written by humans. A dictionary could not have done this: (a brief history to the present)

Because of spending time with people raised in families who knew not God, I was smoking by the age of seven. At nine I started drinking, started smoking pot at 10 and playing drums in a heavy metal band for nine years starting also at age 10. During that time I made $25. 57 an hour at the age of 18-19. I drove a 72, SS Chevelle, had beautiful blondish/brown hair going down to the middle of my back, had a stunning girlfriend, the popularity of a band member, and all the drugs and extra women I wanted. The years that I was knowingly apart from God were the most irresponsible, empty, misguided and ill-directed years of my life. When at 19 years old I saw a vision of destruction while intensely inebriated, my life was about to radically change. A voice relentlessly called me to pick up and read the Bible. I finally listened, and within a month I was baptized. I read the Bible from six to eight hours a day for the first year of being a Christian. I was trained as a missionary and called to be a pastor after only four years of accepting to follow God. Since then I have seen more miracles and have had a far better life than ever I could have imagined possible. Why? Because I committed my self to the God in Bible study, prayer, and witnessing. Since becoming a Christian, I’ve seen many lives changed from being like mine to being like Christ’s in radical ways. These lives are an example of multiple miracles each. Beyond the changed lives, I’ve seen Sheri take a CT Scan that showed a major heart attach which the doctors said must have been a mechanical error because of the further tests that were done the next day after I had prayed for the Lord to give her a new heart. Larry’s granddaughter was only two years old with a tumor inside of her head the size of a man’s fist. After praying on our knees together, Larry’s granddaughter was tumor-less while the doctors had no explanation. What about a man named David? He fell many feet from a rock and exploded his ankle. When going in for an x-ray, the results showed that he needed to be immobilized in that leg and would need a cast after the swelling went down. After praying about it, the very next day he woke up, got out of the bed and put on his clothes. He went to work and saw the doctor come in, a non-Christian doctor, which was amazed at his standing and mobility. What about when I was working and heard a mental voice give me an address? I wrote it down, told the boss about it, a Christian, and she said that I should write a letter to it. I knew that it must be to my girlfriend’s mother, who lived on Jajoba road, so I wrote and sent it. A week or two later the response came back with an exasperating note that said, something like, “Thank you sooo much for your letter DM. I had been praying, and that letter was my answer!” Time would fail us both if I were to recall all the times I needed money, clothes, food, and the basic other needs of life while a missionary. While without pay for a year and a half with my family, God sent ample provisions for myself, my incredible family, and enough to share with others. Now, my life has been so changed as to have a peaceful, loving, happy home with my wife and two amazing children.

My testimony is living proof that there is Divine power in the Bible that works to do what it says it will.

I challenge all of you to use the Bible for the next year to find what you can to prove that God is who you say He is, and you will not only see a Holy and Living God, but an angry devil. Open that Word and give it a fair chance, and your lives too will be changed.

Again, I want to stress that I haven’t altered a single letter or changed the formatting of this text in any way.  The personal testimony you’ve read above has been delivered in exactly the same way it was first presented to me during an online conversation.

I’ve posted the video below in several of my blogs, and it seems it’s necessary to do so again.  It’s important for the religious to understand that personal anecdotes are not proof, as anyone can claim anything and I would have no way of verifying the information.  It would be just as easy for me to claim that an invisible giant fuzzy pickle named Bob cured a tumor as it was for the individual above to claim the Christian God cured a tumor – and both claims have absolutely no evidence to back them up. 

It’s always interesting how the claims of these personal testimonies don’t seem to have any corroborating evidence.  For instance, the person who gave the testimony above was both unwilling and unable to provide a link to a news story from a legitimate news source where a doctor discussed any of these “miracles” occurring.  I know that if I had a serious ailment miraculously cured through supernatural means, I’d have copies of my medical records created immediately and I’d make them available for the whole world to see so that they too could benefit from supernatural healing.

As a side note on the subject of faith healing, you can check out the video of our own trip to Portland to test the claims of faith healers here. I also have a blog discussing a documentary on faith healing titled "The Finger of God" that can be found at this location.



After having read both testimonies, are you seeing a trend here?  Apparently Christians can’t stay off the drugs or keep themselves from cheating on their girlfriends without a belief in a big invisible man in the sky, his zombie son, or his talking snake nemesis.

This all very odd, considering my own atheist version of a “personal testimony.”  I’m an atheist, and I don’t believe in Jesus or Yahweh or Zeus or Thor or Poseidon or Hecate or Allah or Cthulhu or any other deity.  Yet despite this oh-so-damning fact, I am not a drug abuser.  I am not involved in gang violence.  I’m not a thief.  I haven’t been randomly aged to 40 despite my masturbation habits.  I am a married, monogamous, heterosexual man who has never even once cheated on his spouse.  I am a productive member of society with an amazing job. 

What all these testimonies have led me to this is conclusion: a belief in the supernatural is simply not required to be a good person or to keep yourself off the drugs.

Whenever I’ve brought this point up to the religious in my discussions, both online and offline, I’ve always been presented with a question in response.   Christians frequently bring up this objection to give their personal beliefs credence. They will simply ask, “But why would they lie?”

This is a common Christian tactic that is presented in many different settings.  Christians are just as likely to bring up this idea while talking about the gospels of the New Testament as they are to bring it up while explaining modern personal testimonies. 

First of all, it’s quite easy to see why someone would either purposefully lie about outlandish claims or accidentally continue to spread false information due to ignorance of the subject.  Religion gives people things they can’t actually have.  By believing in Christianity, an individual gets to believe that they will live forever in paradise, while the people they don’t like will be punished for all eternity.  It lets people believe that the creator of the universe is looking out for them specifically.  It’s not hard to realize why someone would lie about a personal testimony.

While it’s important to answer the question of “why would they lie?” it’s even more important to immediately turn the question around and post the same query to the Christian.  If the very question of “why would they lie?” is meant to be evidence of a claim’s truth or falsehood, then that question proves the personal testimonies of all people of opposing religions as well.

If the theist is using an argument they absolutely would not accept in any way from members of opposing religions, then the atheist shouldn’t have to accept it from a Christian either.

Consider for a moment if a Christian provided a personal testimony from a friend who had given up a cocaine addiction through belief in Jesus.  When this testimony is met with skepticism, the Christian asks “But why would my friend lie about this?”  Now consider for a moment if I responded to that question with another question: “Why would a Wiccan lie?”

Yes, that’s right, I’ve heard personal testimonies from Wiccans as well as Christians.  In fact, I personally know a Wiccan who was a Sunday school teacher for many years and later converted from Christianity to Wicca because the Christian religion offered her no peace, while Wicca gave her a peace beyond understanding. 

 If this Wiccan woman provided her personal testimony to a Christian, would that Christian in any way be moved to convert to Wicca?  Of course not!  While Christians expect their personal testimonies to convert others, they never consider that people of opposing religions might have equally compelling testimonies.  I’ve heard Wiccans make claims of supernatural healing through casting spells that are on par with any claim of supernatural healing from a Christian due to prayer.

The two testimonies I presented earlier are not by any means the only testimonies I have heard from Christians.  While interviewing a series of Christian heavy metal bands for an article on religion’s role in music (available to be read here) I was sent the following testimony by a musician who goes by the name “Fire” from the Polish black metal band Elgibbor:

I came to a time in my life when I felt the lowest. I was doing drugs and felt like life had no meaning. God used that time to open my eyes through some help of a friend. He showed me that He was more than just religion. God still helps me exist in this cruel world. Sure I have problems just like everyone does, but with God it makes life so much easier.

Now let’s take all these personal testimonies from Christian folks, and let’s compare them to the personal testimony of actress Kirstie Alley, who (much like Mr. Habit, DM, and Fire) claims that her religion got her off drugs (cocaine to be specific).  The kicker?  She’s talking about Scientology, not Christianity, in the following quote:

“This work gives me the opportunity to help people in the fight against drugs, which were ruining my life a dozen years ago. This branch of Narconon especially helps Native Americans in the area. Indians have a big problem with alcohol and drugs. I grew up with an admiration for their culture and was sensitive to their problems.

"Most of the people I know--literally--have been through drug rehabs two or three times. The difference is that this program stops the revolving-door effect. For me it means being drug-free and learning to function in life.

"This program salvaged my life and began my acting career. When I was an interior designer in Wichita I was a druggie and life didn't go well. I'd call in sick a lot, making excuses just so I could do coke.

"When I came to Los Angeles in 1979 I went to the detox center at Narconon. It was like night and day once I had completed the program. I've never had the desire to do drugs since. When I was straight, I had the courage and energy to try to become an actress. I owe my career to my will to stop using."

Neither “Mr. Habit” nor “DM” nor “Fire” can claim fame or an acting career because of their personal testimonies.  Should we take the words of Scientologist Kirstie Alley over the words of these Christians?

But it doesn’t end there.  Consider the personal testimony below found on this site, which also explains a man giving up drugs due to God.  Only this God is Allah, and this man’s religion is Islam, not Christianity.

My life before was bad. I had no direction in life. I was wasting my life away by dropping out of school in the 11th grade. I would hang out in the streets with my friends "partying", getting high, drinking and selling marijuana. Most of my friends were gang members. I myself was never in a gang. I knew most of them before they turned bad, so it was not a problem. I slowly began to use harder drugs. I had dreams, but they seemed too far away for me to make them reality. The more I became depressed, the more I turned to drugs as a temporary escape.

One day a friend of mine told me that he knew where to get some good marijuana. I agreed to go check it out. We arrived and went inside this apartment. There were a couple of people inside. We sat around and talked for a while and sampled the weed. My friend and I bought some and were getting ready to leave when my friend said one of the guys there invited us to his apartment to give him a book.

We left for this guy's apartment. When we got there, he gave my friend a book and asked him to read it, and said that it might help him out with his problems in life. On the way home I asked my friend to show me the book that the guy gave him. It was the Qur'an (Koran).

I had never in my life heard of The Holy Qur'an. I began to briefly read some pages. While I was reading I knew that what I was reading was true. It was like a slap in the face, a wake up call. The Qur'an is so clear and easy to understand. I was really impressed and wanted to know more about Islam and Muslims.

The strangest thing is that I was not looking for a new religion. I used to laugh at people that went to church, and sometimes said that there was no God, although deep down I knew there was. I decided to go to the library a couple of days later and check out the Qur'an. I began to read it and study it. I learned about Prophet Muhhamed (Peace be upon him) and the true story of Jesus son of Mary (Peace be upon him).

If a Christian wouldn’t accept the above personal testimony as proof of the existence of Allah and the truth of Islam, then they simply can’t expect anyone else to accept their personal testimonies as proof of the existence of Yawheh and the truth of Christianity.

Common Religious Tactics: Idiocy, Morals, Monkeys, and Everything

Over the last year or so both Megan and I have been involved in dozens of direct debates, both online and in person, with theists of various stripes and individuals who believe in supernatural events but don’t adhere to a specific religion.  In addition to our own discussions, we also frequently watch videos or read transcriptions of other debates on the subject to remain informed on the various arguments and tactics used by both sides.

While watching a video this morning we came across a condensed version of some of the most frequent arguments we see from theists.  In the clip, the religious individual brought up four main points in rapid succession, while trying to prevent the opposing side from being able to respond to any of them.  Since we’ve seen these same arguments, in one form or another, in many of our discussions with the religious I’ll explain how I respond to them.

Broken down, the objections to atheism were as follows:

1. Atheism is idiocy, because the existence of God is self-evident.

2. Where do your morals come from if you don’t believe in God?

3. Why are there still monkeys around if we evolved from monkeys?

4. How do you explain the existence of the universe if God isn’t real?

When dealing with a barrage of opposition of this nature, frequently delivered all at once, it’s important to take a step back and address each issue on its own.  During debates with the religious, it’s entirely too easy to let the discussion drift between issues quickly without anything being covered in adequate detail, which gives the religious debater the upper hand.  Religious belief of any nature thrives on jumping to conclusions without closely examining the evidence, or even outright ignoring evidence that is readily available and contradics currently held views. With a discussion of this nature, it’s critical to calmly and rationally delve into each objection singly and try to get the opposition to actually think about the answers to these questions, instead of just letting them continue to believe that the very questions themselves somehow prove a point.

Before moving on to dealing with the four issues themselves, at least some time should be taken to clarify what exactly is meant by the term “atheist.”  I’ve had discussions with religious folk who literally believe that atheism somehow equates to active devil worship, despite the fact that atheists don’t believe in the Christian devil.  Other than clearing up misconceptions, explaining the meaning of the term atheism gives you a chance to establish common ground with the theist. 

For example, as an atheist I don’t believe in anything supernatural or in the multitude of gods and goddesses described by mankind throughout our history.  I don’t believe in magic powers or unicorns or fairies or Zeus or Thor or Jehovah or Allah.  While a Christian may completely disagree with me about the existence of Jehovah, most of them are willing to admit that Zeus isn’t real and is nothing more than a fairy tale.  Creating that common ground gives the atheist a better place to argue from and a better way to frame arguments from a perspective both parties can agree on.  Many theists are willing to admit that it would be a nonsensical practice to offer sacrifices to Zeus in hopes of staving off his lightning bolt wrath.  Likewise, I find it equally absurd to think that I need to telepathically affirm my allegiance to the sacrificial lamb/zombie son of Jehovah to avoid an eternity of hellfire and torment.

As a final issue before delving into the issues themselves, it is critical that the burden of proof be discussed with the arguing theist.  When a theist asks a question such as “If God isn’t real then where did the universe come from?” they are working from a worldview where atheists have to disprove the existence of their deity.  This clearly isn’t the case, however, because the burden of proof requires that the person claiming something exists must prove that thing’s existence.  The person hearing the claim isn’t required to disprove the claim.

Consider if we ignored the burden of proof, as so many Christians do, and we worked off the assumption that all beliefs are correct until proven wrong.  This would mean that all Christians would need to disprove the existence of Allah, and conclusively prove that Islam is not the one true religion, before being able to dismiss Islam’s claims.

One of the easiest ways to illustrate this point is to explain an absurd supernatural belief that has no evidence to back it up, and ask the theist to disprove it.  A favorite example of mine is the giant fuzzy pickle named Bob.  Say that I believed the universe was created by a giant fuzzy pickle named Bob, and that Bob’s nemesis (an invisible purple elephant named Tim) created Christianity to lure people away from Bob’s truth.  Christians absolutely can’t prove my belief wrong and conclusively disprove the existence of Bob (to do so would require knowing literally everything in the universe, as Bob may be hiding at the center of reality and actively obscuring himself from human detection). 

I could even say things  like, “But if Tim doesn’t exist, then how do you explain the existence of Christianity?  The very fact that you believe Christianity proves that Tim exists and that he’s lured you away from the truth.  I pray that one day your eyes are opened before it’s too late.” But just because a Christian can’t disprove my claim, doesn’t mean they have to accept it as a valid possibility.  The burden of proof falls on me to clearly demonstrate Bob’s reality – the burden of proof does not fall on the Christian to disprove Bob’s reality.

1. Atheism is idiocy, as God’s existence is clearly self-evident

The first point brought up by the theist in this particular discussion was that all atheists are idiots, because it’s obvious to anyone with a brain that God must be real.  Laying the framework for a common ground is the best way to approach this objection and show how poorly thought out this point really is.  The person making this claim very likely doesn’t believe in Zeus or Mithras, and yet both of those deities were once widely believed in and worshipped with the same fervor that a Christian believes in and worships Jesus.  Clearly the existence of Zeus isn’t self-evident, which means the theist using this tactic needs to explain in great detail how they feel their deity’s  existence is any more believable than the existence of Zeus or any other man made deity. The burden of proof is the killing blow here.  Its one thing for someone to say God’s existence is self-evident.  It’s quite another to provide the credible, verifiable evidence to back up that claim.  An all-powerful God who is omnipresent (meaning he is everywhere at once) should be able to easily appear and prove his own existence, and yet you’ll note this has never once verifiably happened.

As our understanding of the natural world grows, our need for a God to explain mysteries continues to diminish.  Earlier in our history, human beings attempted to appease various gods with prayers and sacrifices in order to ensure good weather for their crops.  Now that our understanding of weather patterns and atmospheric conditions has advanced through the use of the scientific method, we can predict with a great deal of accuracy what the weather will be like in any given region.  As our understanding of weather grows, our need for gods who influence the weather diminishes.

2. Where does your morality come from if you don’t believe in my God?

By asking this question, the theist exposes his or her belief that atheists (or even people who believe in a different deity) must be completely immoral.  In one discussion I had with the Christian we’ll call “DD” (You can find a different discussion I had with “DD” here), he informed me that if he was an atheist there would be nothing wrong with him murdering my entire family, as there would be no God to declare such an action immoral.  That sort of statement, which is used frequently by Christians trying to cite morality as a proof of God’s existence, shows that religion doesn’t actually account for our morals.  How can one be considered a moral person if his first response would be to go on a murder spree if he discovered God wasn’t real?

Before explaining how atheists can have morals and where the atheist’s morality comes from, it should be noted that belief in the Christian deity, or any deity at all, does not somehow bestow moral values. Take, for instance, those parents who have allowed sick children to die by refusing to use medicine and instead deciding to rely solely on the “healing power” of prayer.  I would hope that even theists can agree that killing children through neglect is not a moral behavior, and yet that behavior is explicitly created by belief in God.  (As a side note, be sure to take a look at the video clip of us taking a trip to Portland to test the claims of Christians that prayer can heal diabetes) An atheist would never pick a magical cure over chemotherapy for a child with cancer, or beseech aid from invisible forces instead of getting a diabetic child insulin, but a theist very well may (and in fact have in all too many cases).

The many atrocities caused by religion aren’t a secret by any stretch of the imagination, and literally thousands of examples can be brought up if one bothers to discuss them long enough.  Holy war, terrorism, Christians who bomb abortion clinics and shoot doctors, the Pope’s claim that condoms worsen AIDS and that people in Africa therefore shouldn’t use condoms, child abuse and the direct protection of child molesters, the murder of homosexuals, slavery, stoning women to death for nearly any slight imaginable, and many more completely immoral actions are all caused directly or fostered in a supporting atmosphere by religious belief.

I am an atheist, and I consider myself to be a moral human being.  I don’t rape, murder, steal, destroy property, or attempt to enact legislation preventing people I don’t like from getting married.  But how can I possibly stop myself from doing all these things if I don’t believe in an all-powerful outside force that decides what is morally right and what is morally wrong?

Simple: I follow the golden rule.  I don’t believe any god, be it Jesus or Zeus or any other deity, has a cosmic tally board and is watching to see who is following the rules and who is breaking them. I don’t believe that deity has decided for me what is cosmically right and what is cosmically wrong. People decide on their own, both singly and together as societies, which actions are morally acceptable and which are not.  As an atheist, I don’t require the threat of hell or the dangled reward of heaven to be a good person and prevent myself from hurting others.

At this point the theist is likely to ask something along the lines of: “Why bother being good then if there’s no punishment or reward?”  First off, this very question shows how bizarre the mindset of religious folks really is.  Who has the superior morality – the person who abstains from murder without any threat of punishment or reward, or the person who abstains from murder only *because* of the threat of punishment or reward?  There is nothing inherently moral about giving to charity or being a decent person if the only reason one does these things is to appease a cosmic dictator or ensure a better spot in heaven.

As to why I specifically choose to behave in a moral manner without threat of punishment or promise of eternal reward, the answer is again simple: it is in my best interest to do so.  I don’t want to be stolen from, so I don’t steal.  I don’t want to be murdered, so I don’t murder.  By abiding by the laws of society and my internal moral compass, I help to foster a world in which it is less likely that unpleasant things will happen to me.  Likewise, I help to foster a world that will be safe for my future children.  Belief in God simply is not required for anyone to have moral values.

In many instances the very basis of Christian morality (punishment or reward in the afterlife) is itself immoral.  The Christian denomination of Mormonism has a doctrine known as “baptizing the dead,” in which church members hold baptisms for people who have already passed away.  Mormons believe that these baptisms allow the deceased to reach the celestial kingdom even if they weren’t Mormon in life.  One of the many historical figures the Mormons have symbolically baptized after death is none other than Adolf Hitler, mastermind of the Jewish holocaust during World War 2.  Mormons (or at least the specific Mormons who performed the baptism for Hitler) literally want Hitler to be in heaven.  Where is the morality in that?

One also has to question the morality of a supreme being who decides that an eternity of hellfire is the proper punishment for disbelief. If I, as an atheist who is generally a good person and has never done anything particular “hellworthy,” am to be condemned to hell because I saw no evidence to back up the existence of the Christian God, then I have to call into question that God’s “goodness.”  If God has the ability to prove his existence to me, and therefore save me from being tortured for all eternity, but actively refuses to do so – then it would seem God is the immoral one in this equation.

Finally, there is another important issue to consider when contemplating where morals come from.  If I am correct, and the Christian God isn’t real, then atheists and theists are both taking their morality from men and not from God.  The people asking how I can be moral without belief in God aren’t considering that their morals didn’t come from God either if I am correct in my non-belief.  The various religious figures throughout history who wrote the “holy” books of the world and claimed to receive divine revelation of morality from God were either being actively dishonest or were simply delusional, but either way the end result is the same – all people create their own morals. Some people just claim their morals are backed up by an invisible entity who can’t or won’t show up to confirm their involvement.

3. If we evolved from monkeys why are there still monkeys?

The number of times I’ve seen this question come up in discussions with the religious is actively disheartening, because this is a myth that just won’t seem to die.  Evolutionary biologists do not, in any way, claim that humans evolved from monkeys.  Let me repeat that, as this is key: humans did NOT evolve from monkeys, and no biologist makes this claim.  Christians who ask this question are literally attacking a stance that no one holds to begin with.

Evolutionary biology teaches that humans and chimpanzees share a common ancestor, which likely lived somewhere in the neighborhood of six million years ago.  Humans and chimps both evolved from that common ancestor, taking different evolutionary paths.  The short video clip below shows biologist Richard Dawkins discussing our common ancestor with chimpanzees.



But how can we possibly know this?  Two of the key evidences available for our common descent are the fossil record, and the human genome. Human and chimp DNA is 96 percent the exact same, which is even more of a match than is found between rats and mice. One of the most overwhelming evidences for our common ancestry with chimpanzees is that chimpanzees have 24 chromosomes, while humans only have 23.  Yet when scientists studied one of the human chromosomes, they found it to be a perfect blending of two chimp chromosomes.

Another frequent objection, which usually comes up with this same issue, is for the theist to state there are no intermediary forms or “missing links.”  This is one of the most common misconceptions theists hold in regards to evolution, because the fossil record does in fact have many intermediary forms, both in the evolution of humans and other creatures.  This brief clip from Richard Dawkins shows him discussing the evolution of whales and the many intermediary forms that have been discovered and are readily available for scrutiny.



Evolution is an exceedingly complex subject with many different issues to be discussed. If you’d like to see some of the other objections to evolution brought up by theists, you can check out my earlier blogs about famous creationists Kent Hovind and Ray Comfort. I also have another blog here that covers a common creationist tactic of taking a quote from Darwin about the human eye out of context to purposefully be misleading.  I highly recommend that everyone study the science of modern evolutionary biology further to gain a greater understanding of why mankind is the way it currently is.  Numerous websites are readily available on the subject that can be found with a Google search as simple as “evidence for evolution.” Many books on the subject are easily obtainable, such as Richard Dawkins’ “The Greatest Show On Earth,” which is likely available at your local library.

4. Where did the universe come from if my particular God isn’t real?

This issue is usually an “end game” tactic when debating with theists, as they fall back on the same method of thinking that led people to pray to deities to change the weather.  As mentioned before, the need for God shrinks as man’s understanding of the natural world grows.  One of the remaining mysteries that haven’t been 100% explained by science is: “Where did the universe come from, and why is it the universe as opposed to anything else that it might have been?”

First off, it should be noted that man most definitely isn’t completely in the dark when it comes to the origin of the universe.  As has been discussed in several of my previous posts, the theory known as the Big Bang does have observable, verifiable evidence backing it up.  You can check out two resources on the observable evidence for the Big Bang at this location and also here.

Attempting to delve into a subject like the Big Bang with a theist who hasn’t read anything on the subject that didn’t come from an explicitly pro-Christian source, and will likely refuse to do so anyway, is an exercise in futility.  An easier way to tackle this subject is to again refer to the common ground of disbelief in certain supernatural claims and to bring up the burden of proof.

Say, for the sake of argument, that we have completely misinterpreted all the available data, and that all current ideas on the origins of the universe are completely wrong.  Even if that were the case, it wouldn’t suddenly make a supernatural explanation more likely to be true.  Simply having a lack of data or complete understanding of a subject is not a valid excuse to throw up your hands and proclaim “An invisible wizard in the sky must be responsible!”

Take, for instance, any of the supernatural beliefs mankind has held throughout its history which were shown to be wrong when more evidence became available.  Lightning is no longer attributed to an angry Zeus, but is now understood to be electricity brought about by atmospheric conditions.  There was a time when people fervently worshipped the sun as a deity.  Now we know the sun is but one of many stars composed of burning hydrogen and helium.  We no longer have to attribute sickness and healing to witchcraft or the whim of the gods, but instead to germs and genetic dispositions and medicine.

Likewise, in current times, there is no reason to assume that a supernatural explanation for the origin of the universe is plausible just because there isn’t enough evidence to have a full understanding of the issue yet.  If a theist insists that a lack of understanding somehow shows that God is responsible for the creation of the universe, then the burden of proof shows that it’s just as likely that Zeus created everything as it is that Jehovah created everything – as there is equally no evidence to suggest either being created existence.

It's also important to take into consideration the implications of the claim that God created the universe.  Christians frequently use an argument known as the "clock without a clockmaker" when trying to convince people that the deity of their particular denomination created everything. I attended a Christian school as a child, and I frequently heard this particular argument.  Typically the Christian will say something along the lines of "If you saw a clock lying in the road, you would never assume that clock simply developed by chance. You would assume that a clock implies there was a clock maker who deliberately designed the clock."

On the surface, this seems like a reasonable argument.  It would in fact seem foolish to say that a working clock developed solely by chance instead of assuming someone put the clock together on purpose.  Unfortunately, this is where the Christian stops using logic in order to continue to maintain a religious delusion.  If nothing exists without a designer, and a clock must have a clock maker, then the next logical step is to ask where God came from.  It would be exceedingly hypocritical, not to mention rather nonsensical, for someone to claim that nothing can exist without a maker, and then immediately claim that God can exist without a God maker.

By throwing your hands in the air and proclaiming "Some invisible God being must have done it!" you only move the equation back one step.  In no way does the assertion that (insert the name of any given religion's God here) created the universe actually answer the question of where the universe really came from.

Please feel free to leave a comment below with common theist arguments you have heard, thoughts on my responses, or even how you have responded to Christians or other religionists when they bring up these issues.